Part 16
Have you, in the course of your practice, converted any paved street into a road?—Yes, I have; Fore-street Hill, in Exeter, forms part of that turnpike trust; it is very steep, and was exceedingly slippery, so much so, that I never rode on horseback down it myself till it was converted into a stone road; it has been so for a year or two; it has answered every purpose, and stood remarkably well, and by being watered a little in very dry weather, I believe there is less inconvenience found from dust than when it was paved. I have heard some gentlemen say, that in coming up that hill with their carriages, it not being above a furlong and a half or two furlongs in length, they have saved from five to ten minutes time since it was made road; and I have heard coachmen say, that when they brought their horses quite cool to the bottom of that hill, they have been quite in a lather by the time they got to the top of it, from the terror of the horses in slipping about.
That was when it was paved?—Yes.
What kind of stone do you use for making that road?—The pebble of the country, picked from the gravel pits.
Have you converted any other part of Exeter from pavement into road?—There is no other part of Exeter under the care of the trust; but in consequence of the effect which the Chamber of Exeter saw in Fore-street, they have broken up a great many of the streets in Exeter, and, I believe, are proceeding gradually to do them all. In the town of Newton-Abbot there is a county bridge; the county have broken up the bridge bands, and converted it in a similar manner.
_John Loudon MᶜAdam_, Esq. further Examined.
Have you, in any instance, made the alteration stated by your sons?—Yes, I have; I found the suburbs of Bristol were entirely paved when I took charge of the roads of the district; those suburbs are within the jurisdiction of the commissioners for the care of turnpike roads; and I found the expense of paving was very heavy, and the effect very bad, and I at once took the whole pavement up, and broke the stone that I found there into a stone road, up to the jurisdiction of the magistrates.
Was that granite stone?—No, a kind of stone called the blue pennet in that county, and part of a light stone called Brandon Hill stone; both tolerably good stones: the blue pennet is certainly not so good as granite; the Brandon Hill stone, when broken, is pretty nearly as good as granite. But those suburbs having been taken up, and given great satisfaction the year before last, the magistrates took up half of the street, called Stoke’s Croft, which is the great entrance of the town from Gloucestershire. The inhabitants were very much afraid of dust; and therefore they requested the magistrates not to take up the whole of the street, but to make an experiment on one half of it, and after a year’s experiment they consented to the whole being taken up. When I left Bristol, which is now three months ago, they were busy taking up the remainder of that street; and I understood it was the intention of the magistrates to proceed gradually to take up a great number of other streets in the town.
Do you know what difference it has made in the expense?—That part of the suburbs that was lifted, and laid again with the same stone broken, cost 5_d._ a square yard for doing it. I took up the stone; I had nothing to purchase; the stone that came out of the streets fully made the road, and we had a little remaining for repair afterwards, and that operation cost 5_d._ a square yard; paving, in the city of Bristol, cost 5_s._ 6_d._ a square yard when stone is found by the paviour, and I believe they reckon the laying down to be eighteen-pence of that.
What would be the difference of expense annually between & paved street and a road?—I think that road required no repair for the first three years after it was done.
A paved street would require no repair for seven years after it was done?—I think we repaired it for about a fifth part of the money, when it required repair, that a pavement would have cost. We seldom find our streets in Bristol last above three years; the pavements become rugged, and full of holes, and so on; they are obliged to be taken up, and they relay them generally once in three years. There is another street in Bristol which has been taken up, but I cannot recollect the name of it; it goes from Stoke’s Croft to Kingston; it has been taken up by the magistrates, not under my direction.
Has any objection been taken by any person to the alteration that has been made at Bristol?—No, except the alarm that the inhabitants of Stone Croft had when it was begun to be done, and they got the magistrates to delay doing more than half of it till they were satisfied that it would not inconvenience them; and the circumstance of their sending a request to the magistrates to finish it induces me to believe that they were very much satisfied with the experiment. Park-street, in Bristol, has been done in that way for, I think, seventeen years; I was then a commissioner for watching and paving the streets of Bristol.
Who did it?—It was done at the expense of the commissioners for watching and paving, at my wish, and I certainly did superintend it, though I had nothing to do with it more than any other commissioner had. It is a street many gentlemen know very well; it is a public road from Bristol to the Park, and very steep; I believe it is a rise of three inches in a yard, and when paved was so very dangerous and slippery that many accidents arose from it, and now it is a very good road indeed, and I do not believe that it cost upon an average, since that alteration, more than one fourth of what it used to do.
What stone was it paved with before?—Black rock-stone, a species of limestone.
APPENDIX.
APPENDIX (B.) MEMORANDUM of Mr. Johnson, respecting the Roads under Mr. MᶜAdam’s superintendence.
As I travel rapidly over great distances, and my attention is usually much occupied with the immediate business of the office, I cannot speak with accuracy about particular and local alterations. But I feel myself well warranted in stating, that whenever I have found any thing done under Mr. MᶜAdam’s immediate direction, or by his pupils, or even in imitation of his plan and principles, the improvement has been most decisive, and the superiority over the common method of repairing roads, most evident; and, as superintendent of mailcoaches, I have abundant reason to wish that Mr. MᶜAdam’s principles were acted upon very generally. If they were, a pace, which in winter or any bad weather cannot be accomplished without difficulty, would become perfectly easy, to say nothing of the comfort and safety of the traveller, and the credit to humanity in lessening the hard labour of the animals. I may add, that although so much has been accomplished, the postmaster general could still expedite the conveyance of the mails, and bring the arrangements of the posts nearer to perfection, if the roads were universally as much improved as the practice of Mr. MᶜAdam’s plan would effect.
CHAS. JOHNSON.
_General Post-office, Dec. 8, 1819._
P.S. As one instance of the benefit of Mr. MᶜAdam’s improvement, I beg to mention that the _mail last winter lost ten, fifteen, and twenty minutes, in passing from Staines to Bagshot_, but now the time is _exactly kept_.
C. J.
APPENDIX (C.) LETTER from Postmaster General to the Lords of the Treasury; dated 20th December 1819.
To the Right Hon. the Lords Commissioners of His Majesty’s Treasury.
My Lords,
We beg to acknowledge the receipt of Mr. Harrison’s letter of the 26th ult. transmitting, by your lordships command, the application of John Loudon MᶜAdam, submitting his claim on account of his inquiries relative to the improvement of the roads in this kingdom, and requesting any information in our power with regard to Mr. MᶜAdam’s services.
In conformity to your lordship’s desire, we have applied to the superintendent of mailcoaches, as the officer in our department most competent to give information upon the subject of Mr. MᶜAdam’s exertions; and we beg leave to inclose his report, and to add, that with respect to the road near Staines, to which he alludes, we had found it necessary to give notice of indictment, which has been prevented, by the commissioners resorting to Mr. MᶜAdam’s assistance and advice, which have produced the excellent road mentioned by the superintendent.
The road from Newbury, through Reading to Twyford has been so much improved, that the mail-coach has been better enabled to keep its time than heretofore; and we are convinced, that if the roads near London were improved in a similar manner, considerable advantages would be obtained to the correspondence in general, but particularly in places from ninety to one hundred miles distant.
We are, with great respect, My Lords, Your Lordships very obedient humble servants, CHICHESTER. SALISBURY.
_General Post-office, 20th Dec. 1819._
APPENDIX (D.)
Certificate and Recommendation by several Peers and Members of Parliament, to the Right Honourable the Lord Commissioners of the Treasury, respecting Mr. MᶜAdam’s Claim for remuneration.
It appears to the undersigned, by the report of a Committee of the House of Commons of last session, and by their own experience and observation, that the system of road making, introduced by Mr. MᶜAdam, has already been of great public benefit, as it facilitates the communications of the country, and affords useful and universal employment to the labouring class, with sufficient funds already provided.
The undersigned are of opinion, that as Mr. MᶜAdam obtained the information necessary to perfect his system of road making, entirely at his own expense, and with the labour of many years; and afterwards, by his exertions and those of his family, reduced the system to actual practice, and has now put the public in complete possession of his plans, Mr. MᶜAdam has a claim on the country for remuneration.
They are further of opinion, that it will be a great means of encouraging the general adoption of this improved system of road management, if Government shall be pleased to bestow this mark of their approbation on Mr. MᶜAdam.
Chichester, De Laware, Hardwicke, Macclesfield, Salisbury, Beaufort, G. Clerk, Wm. Rea, Thomas G. Estcourt, Wm. Dickinson, N. Calvert, W. H. Ashurst, J. Fane, J. N. Fazakerley, Carrington, G. Doveton, Dacre, Daniel Giles, Wm. Lamb, George Shee, W. Freemantle, Warren Bulkeley, Grenville, Folkestone, R. Spencer, R. M. Davis.
APPENDIX (K.)
Letter of Postmaster General to the Lords of the Treasury, on Petition of Mr. MᶜAdam for payment of Balance due to him on account of services stated to have been rendered by him in the improvement of the Public Roads.
My Lords,
Mr. John Loudon MᶜAdam having addressed to us a memorial, relative to certain claims on account of the services which he states to have been rendered by him in the improvement of the public Roads of the kingdom, we have the honour to transmit the same to your lordships for such consideration as it may appear to you to deserve; and we have to state, that _the favourable opinions which we entertained and expressed in our former reports upon this subject, have been confirmed by experience; and that by employing Mr. MᶜAdam to survey the roads in Lancashire, the most beneficial results are likely to follow_.
We are, my Lords, with great respect, Your Lordships most obedient servants, CHICHESTER. SALISBURY.
_General Post-office, 6th Feb. 1823._
H. Bryer, Printer, Bridge-street, Blackfriars.
TRANSCRIBER’S NOTES
1. Silently corrected typographical errors and variations in spelling. 2. Archaic, non-standard, and uncertain spellings retained as printed. 3. Enclosed italics font in _underscores_.