Part 98
Q. When men go on a strike, and others will undertake to work in their stead, and they are interrupted by violence and threats of violence?
A. No organization could be accountable for that, and I wish to state here that the late strike was not under the auspices of that organization.
Q. That strike at that time was not under their auspices?
A. The strike was not inaugurated by the organization.
Q. Did the organization approve of it?
A. There was a meeting called. There was a mass meeting, and when that meeting--that meeting adjourned to meet at a mass meeting and take a vote of the committee, and in that second mass meeting they decided to suspend work and join hands.
Q. The second mass meeting was at the silk-works?
A. No, sir.
Q. Where was it?
A. Held in the Round woods.
Q. Where was the first one held?
A. "Fellows' Hall."
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Did this organization--"Kights of Labor"--did they by any resolution or by-law discountenance any interference with men that wished to work?
A. There is no combination to resort to any violence whatever.
Q. Was there anything condemning anything by the men?
A. There was nothing under the organization. The constitution and by-laws is the one safe basis of any society, and from their constitution and by-laws there is nothing whatever but that it is a law-abiding organization.
Q. Do you know of any resolutions being passed by any of those lodges and by this association, condemning interference with men who wished to work?
A. I do not, neither do I know of any resolution that urged anything of that kind.
Q. Were you present at this meeting out here at the silk-works?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What resolutions were passed there?
A. I do not know but very little about the resolutions. I went there in company--at the time, I held the position of chairman of the county and central committee, and was secretary of the Hyde park executive committee, and we went there in company with others of that executive committee--over to the silk-works meeting, with the understanding that there were delegations there from all over the county.
Q. You are secretary of the executive committee of what?
A. Of the miners.
Q. Of those Knights of Labor?
A. Oh, no, sir; it was a committee appointed in this mass meeting of members and non-members. I went over there to that meeting, with the understanding that there were delegates to be there from all over the county. I do not know that our committee was notified officially of this meeting, only it was spoken all over the street, and I presume there was notice in the local press, that there was to be a meeting held. When I went there, there was a few thousand people there, and after a while the meeting was called to order by some gentleman, a stranger to me, and some gentleman, I forget his name, was elected chairman. He was also a stranger to me, and the meeting was orderly--there was a few disorderly men there, but the average of the meeting was an orderly meeting, with the exception of those few that may have been aggravated by seeing these men they termed blacklegs working in their places in the shops. I was told that the meeting was called by the Lackawanna Coal Company, to receive the report of some committee, but I never heard of any committee reporting. I did not take any part there, more so than going round, and when I would hear some one making remarks there, to try to quash him of all such remarks, until a letter was brought there by somebody and read--a letter purporting to be written, as I understood at the time, by W. W. Scranton, and in that letter, it was read there, that Scranton stated something, that the men should live on mush and milk, or something to that effect. I was so far off I could not hear the letter, and that drove these men around there to a rage.
Q. Did you understand that this letter had been written by Scranton?
A. I never thought that was the letter. That was my impression. The impression it left on me was that it was written by some men to accomplish their object--to inspire the men to violate the laws.
Q. Do you know of any resolutions passed at that meeting? Do you know the purport of those resolutions?
A. I do not know of any resolutions.
Q. When this meeting adjourned, what was the general understanding of what was to be done?
A. The meeting adjourned. There were a few that got up a cry to go and drive all the blacklegs out; and the meeting adjourned, and the men started and went up in the direction of the shops.
Q. What do you mean by the shops?
A. The manufactories, you know.
Q. Different manufactories?
A. Yes; and that is the last I saw of the meeting. I could see these men running. I saw these men running up the hill. I didn't follow them. I took the railroad up.
Q. You did not go up with the crowd to the shops?
A. No; I didn't see anything.
Q. How large a crowd ran in that direction, about?
A. I think, maybe, those that went up there might have been three or four thousand people there in the meeting, more or less. I could not make an estimate. There was a large crowd.
Q. What class of men were those that talked about driving the blacklegs out of the shops and mills? Were they men from these shops, formerly?
A. They were strangers to me. I was not much acquainted with this city.
Q. Did the miners join in with that crowd?
A. It was not a meeting of miners; it was a public meeting. You could not say it was miners or mechanics.
Q. You could not tell whether there was any miners joined that crowd or not?
A. Oh, no.
Q. A mass meeting of all classes of laboring men?
A. A general meeting.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Was there any liquor there, or anything to inflame--any drinking going on?
A. Oh, no; not to my knowledge.
Q. You didn't see anything of that kind?
A. Didn't see any man there under the influence of drink.
Q. Do I understand you to say you are a member of the executive committee of miners?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you go there in your official capacity?
A. No, sir; we just met, and agreed to go there together.
Q. To hear some report?
A. Yes, sir; we went over there as a matter of curiosity, being a member of the executive committee of the Hyde Park miners.
Q. What did you expect this report from?
A. We were informed there would be delegates from different places?
Q. They were to make a report?
A. Yes; to know the general situation of the men all over the different parts of the county.
Q. What were they to report about?
A. With regard to what was the condition of the standing of men in different places. That is what we expected they would report.
Q. The condition in what respect?
A. In regard to what was the condition of the lines that were striking, or any sign of a break, or anything of that kind.
Q. That is, whether they were all standing solid in the strike?
A. Yes; exactly.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Did your committee intend to make a report at that meeting, also?
A. No, sir; but we could have made a report in behalf of the Hyde Park men, the men that we represented in committee. If there was any difficulty, we could see that the men at our side were all solid. That is the general phrase of a report, if the men are all solid--all solid.
Q. All stand united?
A. That meant united.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. What wages did you get the last month that you worked?
A. I presume that the men----
Q. I just asked you the question, how much did you get the last month that you worked? How much did you make?
A. The last month?
Q. Yes?
A. We generally work there----
Q. I ain't asking you that?
A. I could not tell you how much I made in the last month.
Q. How much could you make a day?
A. In the Diamond vein a man could make about $1 89 a day, figuring down the price of a car, and allowing for expenses, and the price for labor, loading the coal.
* * * * *
J. F. McNally, _sworn_:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Where do you reside?
A. Sixth ward, city of Scranton.
Q. What is your business? What was it in July last?
A. Boiler tender for the iron and coal company.
Q. Where is that located--the works of the company?
A. Down this side of Shanty hill a little ways.
Q. Were you at work on the 1st day of August?
A. No, sir.
Q. Go on and state why you were not, and give us the facts connected with the strike here, and all that you are acquainted with?
A. On the 8th day of July, I think it was, there was a reduction--it didn't say how much.
Q. A reduction of wages?
A. A notice put up to that effect.
Q. By that company?
A. Yes, sir. We didn't like it very well, and we appointed a committee to wait on Mr. Platt--he was outside foreman there--and see what the reduction was, and the committee went to Mr. Platt, and he was to go to Mr. Scranton. The answer was, that when we got paid we would find out what the reduction was. Mr. Platt stated that Mr. Scranton told him he didn't know it was any of his business to go there--something to that effect. So we worked along, and on the 20th they struck. I was on the night turn, and I worked Monday night, and Tuesday afternoon they struck.
Q. On the 20th of July?
A. Yes; about twelve o'clock. They stated here it was a puddlers'----
Q. It was either the 17th or the 24th--which was it now? Do you think Tuesday, 24th?
A. I could not say positively which it was. I know it was summer. The latter part of the month, or getting that way.
Q. Go on, then.
A. I was on the night turn, and I just got up about two o'clock, and I came over that afternoon a little early, and had a little work to do, and when I was going out mother said to me, "Where are you going? Going to work?" She said she heard they had struck. There was a meeting that night up on the hill. I left the dinner-pail in the house, and went up to the meeting, to see what was going on there. When I got there, Mr. Scranton came about the same time, and he asked what was the matter, and they told him. He said he could not do anything, and he drove away, and that is all there was about it until the 1st of August there was a meeting called to be held at the silk-works. So we went there to hear what it was. We understood it was a report from the miners and other different trades, in regard to what they were going to do, whether they were going to stay out or resume work, or what. After the meeting was called to order, before any committee had a chance to report, or anything of the kind, this letter was produced, and read there.
Q. That was at the silk-works?
A. Yes.
Q. State how the letter read. What the subject of it was. The subject matter, as near as you can remember.
A. The substance of the letter was, Mr. Scranton said he would have the men working if, I think, it was thirty-five cents a day and living on mush and molasses, or he would bury himself in a culm-dump. That was the statement of the letter.
Q. How was the letter signed?
A. Workingmen.
Q. These workingmen stated in the letter that that was what Mr. Scranton had said?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did the letter state when and where Mr. Scranton had made that declaration?
A. No, sir; not to my recollection.
Q. What did the letter advise the meeting to do?
A. It didn't state. That was about the substance of the letter.
Q. Who read the letter?
A. I could not tell you what his name is. I wouldn't know him if I would see him.
Q. Did you come up, then, with the crowd that came up to the shop?
A. No, sir. After the meeting adjourned, part of us came up the railroad towards the L.S. crossing, and I stood there conversing about fifteen or twenty minutes. The crowd had gone towards Lackawanna avenue. After they had dispersed from there, I thought I would walk to town, and I went up, and when I got up to the top of the hill the crowd and I walked through the crowd, and I met the mayor coming down. He seemed to be quite excited. He was going to McKinney's office. I met him a little this side of there. I passed on to Lackawanna avenue, and stood there.
Q. Your recollection of it is the same as that given by Mr. Brown this morning as to what occurred there on Lackawanna avenue?
A. No, sir.
Q. Go on and state, then, how it was?
A. I walked first towards Lackawanna avenue and then I walked back again to Washington avenue and stood down there. The mayor came up, supported by two men, one on each side of him, and the crowd following up. A party says, What is this coming down the avenue? I stood up and I saw it was vigilantes, as they call them, coming down with rifles. They had just about passed about the time the crowd came there. The crowd filed in right behind them. Mr. Boltry stepped back and told them to keep back. With that they turned around again, and with that the first I heard was "crack," "crack," "crack" of the vigilants. They fired right into them.
Q. Was the crowd throwing stones?
A. I had not seen any.
Q. Did you hear any pistol shot from the crowd?
A. No, sir; not there, nor anywhere in that section.
Q. Whereabouts was the crowd when the vigilantes fired?
A. They were right on Washington avenue, from Lackawanna avenue.
Q. Going which direction?
A. They seemed to be facing down Lackawanna avenue.
Q. In this direction?
A. Yes.
Q. When the firing took place?
A. Yes; they were right abreast there.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. How large a crowd was that?
A. I should judge from five to six hundred.
Q. What wages were you getting at the time of the strike?
A. One dollar and twelve cents.
Q. As boiler tender?
A. Yes; I looked after boilers there.
Q. Was that what your wages were about the time of the reduction or before?
A. After the reduction.
Q. How was it before the reduction?
A. Before the reduction it was one dollar and a half.
Q. When was the first reduction?
A. I think it was in March.
Q. How much was it after the reduction in March?
A. One dollar and twenty-five cents.
Q. Then after the last reduction it was one dollar and twelve cents?
A. One dollar and twelve and a half cents.
Q. What were engineers getting in the works where you were at that time?
A. One dollar and a half they were getting before the last reduction. One dollar and thirty-five cents, then, after the last reduction. There is one of the engineers here, who can state that.
Q. What were the men, generally, getting? What wages in the shops?
A. Laboring men were getting eighty cents a day.
Q. What kind of work were they doing?
A. All kinds of work round there--that is, laborers.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. You mean repairing men--truckmen?
A. Truckmen, such as that.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Get eighty cents a day after the first reduction?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. How much were they getting before the last reduction?
A. I think it was either ninety cents or one dollar, or one dollar and five cents.
Q. How much were they getting before the reduction in March?
A. I could not say what they were getting. Puddlers were getting three dollars a ton.
Q. Three dollars a ton before the reduction?
A. Before the reduction.
Q. How much were they getting before the reduction?
A. Two dollars and seventy cents I think it was, and that had to be divided between two.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. They had a helper?
A. At this time two puddlermen were in together.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. How much would they puddle per day, on an average?
A. A ton was about all they were allowed to puddle. Twenty-two hundred, about that--twenty-two hundred I think was allowed for a ton.
Q. What then did they make per day, on an average?
A. Between one dollar and thirty-five cents and one dollar and fifty cents.
Q. Was this reduction of wages that was made in July general?
A. Yes; it was a general reduction--stated so.
Q. Among all the men?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did it apply to you?
A. The notice read that it would be a general reduction.
Q. Did the reduction apply to officers of the company--book-keepers and so forth?
A. That is something I could not state.
Q. Is a ton a day all that two men can puddle?
A. Yes--about that.
Q. Don't they puddle more than that some days?
A. They may perhaps--two hundred over that.
Q. Two hundred over? They are paid for all they make over, are they not?
A. That is something I cannot state. They are only allowed a ton.
Q. Did other companies here reduce their wages also?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. At the same time?
A. Well, somewhere around there. This company was the first that struck here.
Q. In the meetings that you attended among the men who struck, was there anything said about interfering with those parties of men who were willing to work?
A. No, sir; they were committees appointed to go and wait on them, and ask them civilly whether they could work. There was no violence of any kind.
Q. Committees appointed to visit them, and ask them to quit work?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Until they got the wages they want?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did they fix upon any definite price per day that you would demand?
A. Yes; we asked them twenty-five per cent.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. Twenty-five per cent. advance?
A. Yes; there was a committee appointed between boiler tenders and engineers of the company, to wait on the former and demand it.
By Senator Reyburn:
Q. Were you on that committee?
A. No, sir.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Well, now do you know----
A. I was on after. We could not get no one over there after we met altogether. There was a committee appointed to wait on Mr. Scranton, and I was on that committee to ask Mr. Scranton.
By Senator Reyburn:
Q. What reason did Mr. Scranton give?
A. He said he could not do it. He was not getting price enough for his iron, and could not afford to give it. He said these were just as big a price as any other company. There was one witness stated here to-day, in regard to after the coroner's inquest was held, that they were to take them in carriages to Wilkes-Barre after the arrest. There was no such proposition made.
Q. Were you at the coroner's inquest?
A. Yes, I was there--a witness there. They were to make these arrests and put them in the lockup here, and take them to Wilkes-Barre. They were not to take them by night.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. How do you know?
A. Because I was there all the time.
Q. Have any conversation with the officers?
A. No, sir; it was somewhere about eight o'clock in the evening, or seven o'clock, when the verdict was given, and all the evidence was taken. Then the arrest was to be made immediately after that. He stated then, that there was an indictment in Wilkes-Barre, one for murder and one for manslaughter. There was not. There was only one indictment fetched against them. It was for manslaughter.
Q. Against whom?
A. Against the vigilants.
Q. Do you know how much the miners made per day during May, June, and July, 1877?
A. The miners stated to me that they could make on an average about one dollar and fifty cents a day.
Q. During May, June, and July?
A. Yes, sir; they were not working on full time. Some days they would make half of that. They were paid by the car, and they would not get the cars.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. What was your object in coming up Lackawanna avenue at that time? You say you came up and stood on the corner?
A. I most generally come up every day two or three times.
Q. You had no particular mission to go up there?
A. No, sir.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. Expect to see any fun?
A. No, sir; I did not.
Q. Did you expect there was anything going on?
A. No, sir; never dreamed of anything.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Did you know there was a crowd of men driving the men out of the works.
A. No, sir; had not seen any.
Q. Did not know anything about that at all?
A. Did not see that at all. The men came out peaceably. I did not see any men around.
Q. Did you see the crowd going up to the works?
A. The place was on the road coming up.
Q. You were at the meeting at the silk-works, and came up?
A. No, sir; I took the railroad.
Q. Did the railroad lead you by the shops?
A. No, sir.
Q. Were you about the shops when the men were driving the workmen out--when the crowd was?
A. Yes. I just came there about the time the workmen were coming out. I did not see them driven out.
Q. Did you go inside the shops?
A. No, sir.
Q. You were along there just as the workmen were coming out?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was the crowd chasing any of them?
A. Not that I saw.
Q. The workmen came out peaceably and quiet? There seemed to be no trouble?
A. There did not seem to be any trouble.
Q. At what shops?
A. Delaware, Lackawanna and Western.
Q. At the lower shops?
A. At the first shops as you go down the hill.
Q. Did you see any men coming out of the lower works immediately in the vicinity of where the stables are?
A. No, sir; I did not. I met them after the crowd had passed.
Q. Passed them?
A. Yes; and I asked them what the difficulty was. They told me the men came there and ordered them out, so they went out. They stood all around the streets there.
Q. Have you any knowledge of some men being clubbed and beaten and injured?
A. No, sir. Did not see any clubbed, injured, or beaten in any way, shape, or manner.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. Do you not know that such things did take place--that some were beaten and driven out violently?
A. It was talked so. I never heard a man say he was hit.
By Senator Reyburn:
Q. Did you see the mayor hit?
A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see the mayor bleeding as if he had been struck?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you see that crowd that came out of the shops with clubs in their hands?
A. No, sir; I did not.
Q. Did you see any men----
A. When the mayor got there I passed right on Lackawanna avenue.
Q. Did you see anybody in this crowd that came up Washington avenue with clubs?
A. I saw some boys had sticks--or laths, rather.
Q. What do you mean by boys?
A. Boys from twelve to fourteen.
Q. You did not see any attack made on the mayor at all?
A. No, sir; I did not. Not to my knowledge.
Q. Did you see Father Dunn?
A. I think I did see the mayor struck. I would not be positive though. I think I saw the mayor struck. I would not be positive.
Q. Who struck him? A boy?
A. No, sir. I think it was a man.
Q. What did he strike him with?
A. I could not see what he struck him with. I was quite a distance away. I was up on Washington avenue.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. At what point was it you saw the mayor struck?
A. Right below the culvert.
Q. The causeway under the railroad?
A. Yes, sir.
By Senator Reyburn:
Q. What did the crowd say when they came up Washington avenue? Did you hear any expressions from the crowd what they were going to do?
A. When I passed by I heard them ask who it was that was going towards McKinney's office. They said it was the mayor. Those were the only words I heard spoken.
Q. You say you came up Washington avenue, and sat down?
A. I sat down on the corner of Hunt's store, on Washington avenue.
Q. When the crowd came up--after the vigilants came up the street--did the crowd say what they were going to do?
A. No, sir; they walked right along up the streets.
Q. What did those boys say?
A. The boys were ahead of the men. I did not pay much attention to what was going on. I saw the crowd pass up.
Q. Was there much noise?
A. No, sir.
Q. Walking quietly, were they?
A. Yes; they were walking at a fair gait.
Q. Now, was there not some kind of a row when the mayor was struck; were they walking quietly then?
A. They were standing--the majority of the crowd were standing down around the shops at that time.
Q. Where did this man come from that struck the mayor--that you think struck the mayor?
A. I could not say where he came from.
Q. Did he not come out of the crowd?
A. That is something I could not say, either.
Q. You must, certainly, if you got an impression on your mind that you saw him struck--you must certainly know where the man came from--you say it was a man?
A. I think the first I saw of the man, was right in front of the mayor. Where he came from, I could not say anything of the kind.